rusty rear floor 33 PD coupe

[twpoulter]

Here are a couple of shot where the paint has lifted, I have measured the paint thickness between 0.016/ 0.024", there is a red oxide type paint with a very thick pink primer and I will try and get some photos of these various layers in the next couple of days.

Tom
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[twpoulter]

Just a quick update, I purchased this car for matchlesspat in 2012. After repairing the trunk pan and all across the rear panel it was put into store while working on 2 other Plymouths . This is where I am today, the paint overtime started to crack mainly at the sharp corners of the bead lines and there are a lot of bead lines.

Tom

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[TodFitch]

I have no issues with cruising at 60 MPH (100KPH) in my PD with its original 4.375:1 rear end and 190 cu. in. engine. However I much prefer back roads and speeds below 50.

The transmission does not have synchronizers but it does have sliding "dog clutches"  that make it a little less of a crash box than cars where you actually slide the gears to change ratios. Up shifting a low speeds is generally quiet but down shifting pretty much requires double clutching. Use of heavier gear lubricant makes this easier. And if you have the free wheel engaged, shifting is easier yet. But I normally leave the free wheeling locked out.

[matchlesspat]

Hi Jim,
  More good news, thanks,

I understand the RHD cars had twin wipers due to the left side wiper mount hole being factory made with a raised edge and the right side hole just being a drilled hole added later during manufacture, I suppose they could have just put a grommet in the left hole, I bought the car from a different guy in Natal who had bought it from Burt unfinished, it still has the same PE engine, The 25194 number looks to me to be a later addition, not uncommon in South Africa when old cars were often used with whatever papers were to hand!
It seems to be the same specification as the South African two tone green car (TJ 22112) I have seen pictured on a post card etc. I actually have a lot of pictures of that green car as it's pictures were used in the 1985 McCarthy Group annual report, McCarthy were Plymouth importers in the early days! 

I have just removed the door pillar tag (held on with two flat topped tapered nails?) and it is gray underneath!

Number stamped into left frame rail just behind the axle is 0145 although the first part of the 0 is worn away and so there could have been another number that is completely missing but I don't think so,

  Regards,

   Pat

[Jim Benjaminson]

Pat - I've had this car in our data base for quite a few years.  I had it registered to a Burt Seabrook of Pinetown, Natal, South Africa.  The serial number is 2138687 as you stated.  The engine number was PE189366 - I'm assuming thats the same PE engine that is in your car now.  The body number is PD16413TPC.  I have no idea what the 25194 number is for - although there is a stamped number in the cowl of most Plymouth's that has never been identified as to what it means.  The original engine number should be stamped into the left rear frame rail.  I'm not sure if your car was a knocked down or not---it might have been imported as a complete car.  The build record would give that information.  The body number PD16413TPC breaks down as PD - means Deluxe, the numbers are the sequential build numbers for the rumble seat coupe - and TPC means it is a rumble seat coupe.  If you would contact me, I'd like to update the owners data on the car.
Jim Benjaminson

[FourDoor]

Amazing. It would seem you have yet still another version of the PD, a full size deluxe RHD American car sold in Africa. Normally the overseas cars had locally applied stuff,like 12 volts, that separated it from the North American standard. The second wiper motor was an option and not too common. The same for the horns and the steel (chromed?) covers on the sidemounts. 17" wire wheels were the common ones but it could of had fancy wooden ones. The tranny is not syncro,it's a crash box. Double clutching is in order. Although if you drive with the free wheeling engaged, you can get fairly quiet shifts if you take your time through the gates. No snap shifts. The car in good condition will do an honest 60 mph/100 kms for a long stretch but prefers 50/55 mph.?

[matchlesspat]

Hi, It has twin vacume wipers, 6 volt US electrics but nothing from the interior soft trim has survived except the seat springs, has the horns mounted under the headlamps and did once have steel covers to the sidemounts, 17" spoke wheels, freewheel gearbox (now dissabled), do these gearboxes have syncromesh? I strongly suspect the number stamped into the cowl just under and to the left side of the coil is a later addition, good news that the tag number is correct,

many thanks,

  Pat

[FourDoor]

The 2138687 tag from the door post is the production serial number or today we call it the VIN. The number has no hidden codes. But because it's American production from the 30s you can get a copy of the original build ticket from Chrysler in Detroit. Go to Tod's site and there is an address for Chrysler Historical. Send $45 USD and the volunteers at the museum will look up your cars' build ticket via the serial number,2138687, and they will send you a copy. I'm not sure what you get for a knocked down job. For a regular car,you get the colour,engine serial number,dealer destination etc. I know that PD/PCs that went to England to Chrysler Kew Gardens had 12 volt Lucas systems installed when they got there,instead of the North American 6 volt Delco, as well as locally produced leather upholstery. And they were of course RHD. They also may of had electric windshield wiper motors.? I don't know about South Africa. Does your car fit this British or the North American style of build?
The second number,25194, comes from a plate on the engine side of the cowl?? Where is it 'stamped into the cowl'?? It may be a sequential number from the body assembler in South Africa. The Plymouth body number should be on a tag on the firewall that actually says BODY NUMBER. The same tag should also be stamped by the line crew as 'SED'(Sedan) or 'CPE' (Coupe) for the actual body style. At least that's North American production markings.? The engine number is line stamped into a flat boss on the upper left side of the engine above the generator. Since you have a PE engine in it now the stamping should state 'PE' and then a sequential number for that 1934 engine.?

[matchlesspat]

thanks for the reply,
it is 112" (with sidemounts) and has a temp gauge (ammeter missing,u/s), of the two numbers I gave what one is correct? or do both mean something? are there any stamped numbers?

Is it possible to get a dating certificate based on those numbers and a selection of photo's? I will need something to get it registered here in the UK,

It was sold new into South Africa (RHD) either Port Elizabeth or Durban,  It has now got a PE engine fitted, slightly bigger?

Rear axle ratio around 4.3-1 , what sort of cruise speed can I expect? we have a problem with trucks cutting us up here in the UK, they are limited to 55mph and are a big problem to my 29 Dodge DA as it is happy at 50 mph and they keep overtaking, slowly!

  Pat

[FourDoor]

Dont' have any photos or info on the rear floor of a '33 but I have a list of serial numbers and yours indeed seems to fall into the PDX 'knock down jobs' built in the US for overseas shipment. Your  car may not be a 'full size' PD but may be a short wheelbase PC with PD grille, bumpers and headlights. The engine may also not be the American standard 3 1/8" bore but may be a 2 7/8" small bore for British consumption. They taxed the car every year by engine displacement? The smaller the bore the less the road tax. What is the wheelbase measurement from a point on a front wheel to the exact same point on a rear wheel? Is it 107"/108" or 112"(111 3/4")? Does the instrument cluster have a water temp guage in it? The PC didn't.   
? You may want to determine exactly what you have before getting photos and measurements. The PD and PDX? MAY? have different floors although the differnce between the short wheelbase PC and the long wheelbase PD is supposed to be only from the cowl (scuttle) forward.? ? ?

[Bob]

Pat,
Go to www.ply33.com

There will be some great information there that will help you.

His name is Tod Fitch and he is a member of the POC.

Hope this helps,
Bob

[matchlesspat]

Hi,
at long last I have started work on my 33 PD rumble seat coupe, I need some help regarding how the rear apron that covers the rear frame cross member attaches to the body and location and size of drain holes in the trunk floor, my car has been "repaired" with fiberglass matt etc in that area and I want to remake the rusty parts in steel, If anyone has pictures of the rear of the trunk floor can they email them to me so I can see what is missing, apart from that rust and two small patches just in front of the rear wheels the car is sound, I AM NOT MAKING A HOTROD, so I want to make it as correct as possible,

As far as I can see all the water that washes over the trunk lid (RS coupe) goes inside the trunk! or am I missing something from the bottom edge of the lid?

also I have a rack for the rear but no mounts or arms etc, just the rack and the two U section parts that actually bolt to the rack, can anyone help with drawings/ pictures of the arms and castings that mount to the frame? ( my car has twin sidemounts)

I live near London England so cannot easily look at another car, I imported this RHD car from Africa about 5 years ago, and will need a lot of help getting it right,

Is there a number actually stamped into the frame anywhere? I have no paperwork for this car and the number stamped into the cowl looks suspect (25194) I have a tag on the right door pillar with number 2138687, could be a repro tag? I understand these cars were supplied in kit form to South Africa and assembled there possibly with some local content, so numbers may be no help,

? ?Regards,

? Pat