1956 savoy p-28 starting problem .

[elmo]

I have been playing around with old cars , mostly mopar brands for as long as i can remember , as a hobby for the last twenty odd years , before that as daily drivers .the 3rd car i owned, in 1960 was a 1938 dodge I have never ( i must be one of the lucky ones ) had to replace a condensor rotor or cap but have had to occasionally replace the points or coil. i found if the problem was not one of these it was usualy the wire that went from the coil to the side of the distributor to the points.

[FourDoor]

You can't trust the old waxed paper condensers. They were terrible ,most being leaky,partially shorted, from new. If fact many of your old cars can be experiencing low high voltage because of those leaks. The 'leaking' means that there is always a resistive path across the points and the coil never does completetly dump it's full charge when the points open. Consequently the high voltage spike isn't near as high as designed with the obvious resulting starting and running problems.
If you put a digital volt/ohm meter across an old condenser you'll find they all have some resistive leak through them. And if they don't have one now ,the heat and the current spike through use will eventually make them go 'leaky'.? And for each ohm of resistance, you will? lose some more high voltage at the plugs. The 'leak' also reduces the actual capacitance value and detunes the tank circuit made up of the coil (inductor) and capacitor. If the circuit is in tune , the deposit of point material through arcing will be equal, and very minor,to each point face. If the cap. value moves away from the point of the correct circuit tune, the point material will start to deposit on one of the points more than the other. This is the way you tell if you have the wrong value of cap. in the circuit or the condenser is 'leaky',i.e. gone resistive. One point will start to have a mound of metal deposited on it's face and the other, the donor, will start to develope a pit ('pitting').





( I replace my condensers with modern polystyrene capacitors. Most systems used capacitance in the range of .22 mfd. to .25 mfd. / 600 volt. You can gut the old metal can condenser and leave it on the outside of the dist. for authenticity and put the new capacitor on the inside RTV'd to the point plate with one pigtail connected to ground and the other connected to the moving point. The capacitor is basically wired across the points. A bonus is you'll find your points will last longer but I'm not sure why. Our daily drivers all have capacitor discharge ignition systems on them and it's polystyrene capacitors that have made them so reliable. This change will stop you chasing condenser problems forever as a polystyrene capacitor will out live your car and you. )? ?? ? ?

[elmo]

OneOldSailor
all of the previous  replys are good ones , but you state that you have replaced ,condenser,points,cap and rotor but that it doesn't have the original coil .i assume from this that it still has the old coil and that you haven't replaced it if you haven't done so  already , i would have it tested , any auto electrical shop should be able to do it ,

[FourDoor]

A wierd fault that I seem to remember coming up on the board for this 'no spark' problem was the replacement rotor was too short ,either in height or in 'arm' length?,? to allow the spark to jump over to the cap. The gap between the rotor end? and the 6 cap points is only supposed to be around 20 thou. or so.
? ?But in any case, you should first try to determine if the coil will fire even one plug. Just take the high voltage coil to dist. cap wire off the dist. cap and connect it to a spark plug and lay the plug on the engine head. With the dist. cap off, just flick the points open and closed with the tip of a screwdriver and a spark should jump across the spark plug's gap each time the points open. This test HAS to work first BEFORE you go any further in your troubleshooting. This tests the coil,condenser and points.
Once you have this much working you can put the dist. cap on and with the same single spark plug laying on the engine, see if it sparks when the engine is turned over when connected up to it's dist cap wire. If it doesn't then the spark is not leaving the dist. cap and going to the plugs and you may have the above problem with the rotor.? ? ?

[57plymouth]

Start with the simple stuff, because that's what usually throws you for a loop. 

First, are you getting voltage to the coil?

Are you getting voltage to the points?

Do you have spark at the coil wire?

Do you have spark at the cap?

Do you have spark at the wires?

Does your rotor fit the distributor shaft well?  I have had problems with ill fitting rotors in the past.

Start off by finding why the coil isn't giving spark.  If it is not getting voltage, then you need to find out why it is not.  If it is getting voltage, then you need to find out if it is working.  You may try swaping in a spare coil to see if yours is bad.  If it is not the coil, then check your wires for resistance or cracks. 

Remember that Flatties are stone-simple and low maintenance.  Don't overlook the obvious thinking there are some special tricks on them.  I have made that mistake all too often.

[36 Ply]

I consulted "What to do when your car conks out", a 1957 insert in a Popular Science magazine.

Reference no spark, it says to check the following:

Wet ignition

Grounded large wire from coil to distributor

defective rotor

Dirty points

Points out of adjustment

Shorted condenser

Defective primary ground (skinny wire running from coil to side of distributor) On my former '54 I-H pickup, the wires were broken internally in this wire. It would barely run 40 mph until I replaced this wire.

Defective ignition switch

Defective wire from ignition switch to coil

You might also try replacing the above wires one at a time, in case they are broken internally.

Regards,

Pat O'Connor

[36 Ply]

I'm on my first cup of coffee. and a bit fuzzy....

However,? I have gotten bad thermostats and bad spark plugs, brand new out of the box. I won't even install a thermostat any more until I test it first, to see if it opens when it should.

I've had situations where I installed a bad (brand new) part, then blamed my troubleshooting skills for the repair not working. It's possible that one of your parts is bad, even if brand new, or new old stock.

I'm sure you'll get some good troubleshooting advice from this group; I have a booklet entitled "What to do when your car wont run" out in the garage; I'll check it for info when I'm fully awake.

Regards,

Pat O'Connor

[OneOldSailor]

Hello everyone .I,m a new member and have a 1956 4-door savoy p-28 flat head 6 to restore (ITS GOT FINS)anyway, replaced the condenser. points,cap and rotor and still dont get any spark .it dosent have the original coil in it. any helpful advice would be apperiated. thank you.