OK I've tried everything from the big hub puller, to riding the car with the nuts on the rear drums loose, to get the hubs to loosen and nothing works. What's my next possible attack plan, short of heat or cutting the rivits to remove the drum and then work on the hubs, or removing the bolts in the backing plates and pulling the whole axle and then working on the hubs. Have posted this question in Dec. and was just able to work on them now. Ready to pull what little hair I have left, out. Need to get them off to work on rear wheel cylinders. Lost all the fluid through the driver side rear cylinder. Thanks in advance for any and all help.
Captbrian41
Are the brake shoes hanging up on the edge of the brake drum? I've seen the drumss so worn that there is a lip on the outer edge of the drum and the shoes are "inside" the brake drum, catching on the lip. Just a thought but I'm sure you've backed off the brakes as much as you can.
Thanks Jim, yes I have the shoes backed off as much as possible and the drums are spinning completely free.
thanks Brian
What type puller did you use. I bought an OTC heavy duty model 7394 with three legs and my right rear drum came off. I ordered two more legs in case I encounter a tougher one later. I also removed the plug on the axle for greasing on my '37 and pumped Kroil and Mousemilk penetrate in until it ran out the keyway.
I want to thank everyone for their input on this problem. I got the hubs and drums off today with a puller and soaking them well with liquid wrench. Don't know why they didn't come off in Dec. but they're off now and I can attack the brake problem now. Found the leaking wheel cylinder, front of the drivers side rear wheel cylinder. All the parts are good and cleaned up well, even the rubbers are like new. Will croqus cloth the bores and pistons and put everything back together.
thanks Brian
Captain Brian.....You are now a member of a select circle of Plymouth owners who have succeeded in pulling the rear brake drums. Congratulations.
A word of warning however. Under no circumstances do you drive the car with these drums loose on the taper. On reassembly, make sure everything is clean and dry (no lubricant on the axle tapers) Place the drum in position, make sure the key is in place....... it is best to leave it standing proud until the drum is in place..... make sure the taper is fully set by tapping the drum on the rivet heads.... not too hard.... then install the washer and tighten the nut firmly. Install a new cotter pin and trim the ends so you do not get snagged on it while changing a wheel.
Hey David, thanks for the kind words and the info on putting the drum back on. Found the WC's to be in excellent shape and the shoes to be new. Someone must have changed them out at one time. Was able to order the cups from Napa they are a stock item from Wagner Lockheed, 1 1/4" bore and 1 3/8" bore in a stepped cylinder. Used croqus cloth to polish the pistons and bores and everything should go back together nicely. Someone mentioned recently that the Dot 3 brake fluid is like a sponge when it comes to moisture and once a bottle is opened it should be discarded and not put in the system. Only new from an unopened bottle should be used. it seems that I have a moisture problem because the WC's had a lot of rust in them. I'll either have to wait till I get someone to help me bleed the brakes or perhaps I can set up a resevoir high on the firewall and actually fill them through gravity. What do you think about that? Short of making that pressure bleeder that I saw on the discussion board recently.
thanks again, Brian
I have converted four cars to Dot 5 Silicone fluid over more than 10 years with no problems. It won't hold moisture and won't damage paint if spilled. I also made a pressure bleeder from a garden sprayer and it is definitely the way to go, very useful tool, fast, and no more trying to teach someone how to bleed brakes.
Brian, I did not say why the tapers should not be oiled up but it is because they seem to stick even tighter.
As for silicone fluid, it has many advantages, but unless you are doing the whole system from end to end, it is not recommended that the two fluids be mixed. On the downside for silicone, it aerates very easily and this can be a problem when bleeding. Personally, I have decided that it is not worth the extra expense. Regular Dot 3 does have an affinity for moisture which can be a problem, but I have had less difficulty with rust jamming up the works when the pistons outside the rubber cups have been greased with rubber lube.
I have always thought a pressure bleeder would be nice, but my wife has gotten so good at pushing gently on the pedal , I know she would feel left out. Actually, I am surprised she agreed to do it at all after the sarcasm which flowed from me the time I discovered she was pushing the clutch rather than the brake.
thanks again David, I put one hub back on this afternoon and did just what you suggested, no lube at all, adjusted the shoes and it sems fine. The passenger side which I had no trouble with may have a small leak on the back side of the W/C, I'll wait till tomorrow to check it out. Made a pressure bleeder and boy it worked great. Did a job that always took two, by myself. I'm thinking I may put the hub and drum on without the key so i can adjust the shoes and then check the pedal and see if that leak continues or if it was a fluke. That way I don't have to get into pulling the hub again with the puller.
Brian
Quote from: captbrian41 on February 29, 2008, 07:51:26 PM
thanks again David, I put one hub back on this afternoon and did just what you suggested, no lube at all, adjusted the shoes and it sems fine. The passenger side which I had no trouble with may have a small leak on the back side of the W/C, I'll wait till tomorrow to check it out. Made a pressure bleeder and boy it worked great. Did a job that always took two, by myself. I'm thinking I may put the hub and drum on without the key so i can adjust the shoes and then check the pedal and see if that leak continues or if it was a fluke. That way I don't have to get into pulling the hub again with the puller.
Brian
It is not the key that makes the hub hard to remove. It is the mating of the tapered shaft on the axle and the tapered hole in the hub.
Quote from: TodFitch on February 29, 2008, 09:25:58 PM
Quote from: captbrian41 on February 29, 2008, 07:51:26 PM
thanks again David, I put one hub back on this afternoon and did just what you suggested, no lube at all, adjusted the shoes and it sems fine. The passenger side which I had no trouble with may have a small leak on the back side of the W/C, I'll wait till tomorrow to check it out. Made a pressure bleeder and boy it worked great. Did a job that always took two, by myself. I'm thinking I may put the hub and drum on without the key so i can adjust the shoes and then check the pedal and see if that leak continues or if it was a fluke. That way I don't have to get into pulling the hub again with the puller.
Brian
It is not the key that makes the hub hard to remove. It is the mating of the tapered shaft on the axle and the tapered hole in the hub.
You need to use anti-seize compound on the tapered shaft during final assembly of the rear hub to axle. Plus clean the axle and hub, remove all deposits of grime and rust. These are the things that cause seizing to the axle.
Well I'm finished. Everything back together and took the old girl for a ride. Great day here in eastern NC, 65 deg. and sunny. My pressure bleeder worked like a charm and I guess I didn't have a leak in the W/C after all but will keep an eye on the floor. Took the wheel back apart that I had put together yesterday and put a small amt. of neverseize on both axle tapers and then tightend everything up and had a good firm pedal.
Sorry David but as I mentioned in a post in Dec. I'm a retired pipefitter and always had great luck taking any thing apart that had been neversized even bolts on high pressure steam lines. With the likely hood that I may have to do this again in the future I just had to use it. Will report back on it if I ever have to take it apart again.
One thing I might mention about a pressure bleeder for all you old timers out there of which I am one, make the bleeder with enough tubing to reach the farthest wheel so you can take the bleeder to the wheel with you. I had to get up and down quite a few times at each bleed point to make sure I had enough pressure and fluid in the tank and had I had it close by me it would have been a snap. When you are finished you can relieve the pressure in the tank and then drain the fluid out of the tubing no problem, no mess.
thanks again everybody who posted with help I really appreciate it.
Brian